The Fall of a Senegence Crown Princess

**POST EDIT*** OH MY GOSH!! You guys the response from this has been overwhelming and so fun!! If you want more info on doing Maskcara email me at simplicityandchaos@gmail.com

Oooooooook. This is going to be a very long, confusing story about how I was teriminated as a Senegence Crown Princess , but its important you stay with me till the end. Well at least I think so. First let’s start with the basic details.

  • I started with Senegence in April 2016
  • I became a Crown Princess in January 2017
  • I was placed on suspension in February and eventually terminated in March
  • I was passionate and adamant about not lying to my team in any way and pushing them to think outside the box

So! Let’s begin. When you sign up with Sengence you sign an agreement, as with all direct sales companies. It’s called their policy and procedures document which I will call P+P for the rest of this blog post. If you don’t know, Senegence is a company that has been around for almost 20 years and is run by a bunch of old ladies, let’s call them older woman. This product, LipSense, took off via social media at the end of 2015. No one saw it coming, no one expected it to blow up the way it did, and the company started growing faster than they could handle. Good problems to have, that’s what I kept telling myself and my team. One of the biggest problems in this whooooole story, is that Senegence never bothered to go back to their P+P and update them for technology and social changes. Thus starts the problem I encountered. As a Senegence distributor, you buy the product at wholesale price, and resell it at retail value, keeping the profits as your commission. Now, remember the older women who run the company? Well they started it as a business to do in home parties. Remember those? Tupperware parties, Mary-Kay makeover parties, yeah, those. Welp. Welcome to 2017, Senegence. Customers want to buy online. They have a need for instant gratification, check out now, 2 day shipping, etc.. They don’t want to have to message a friend or stranger, have a long drawn out conversation of what they want to buy and eventually the awkward tie in to “do you want to be a distributor, too?” since distributors are supposed to push the “Senegence choice”, another huge problem. So. My team and I set out to find a way to sell inventory faster and more efficient. Up until this point really your only option was to keep track of things on an Excel spreadsheet, do postage on another site, track taxes on your own, agh. It’s just a hot mess.

Enter Shopify!!! The holy grail of the issue. Solves it all. You can list your own inventory, amounts, discount codes, do a blog on it, make it your own little personal boutique. It tracks orders, postage, tracking numbers, taxes, profits, expenses, the works!! In the P+P it says you can not “conduct business on any site besides a Senesite (which is a crappy, terrible, outdated and ugly storefront website that the company bends you over for $30 a month to maintain)”. We needed a solution. Shopify is SUPER customizable. We made it so that you never ever ever entered payment info on the site, thus not completing a sale. Instead you added items to an invoice, then submitted the invoice for approval and payment details. It was perfect, everyone SHOULD have been happy. After all, I received these emails from compliance:

Huzaah!!! Right? Well no. You see, they have a HUGE issue in that no one in the compliance office actually understands the P+P document and the legal verbiage it uses. So they all just take shots in the dark and hope the issue never comes up again. Lovely. So, we take off the payment section on the site. Done. Gone. Compliant now, right? Not so fast. Remember Google Docs? How 99% of Senegence distributors take their orders and track it? Well when an order comes in on their Google Doc, they send the customer an invoice on PayPal. So. With our little Shopify order system, it took the order, then sent them to PayPal to pay for it. You would think the compliance team would see that although they were different platforms, the transaction was the same. Nope. 

At this point I want to know WHERE they are getting these answers. I want to know where in the P+P it says we can’t do what they are saying. I write back several times, ask several questions, they never respond. Ever.

I even dumb it down for them and make a graphic so they can have a visual picture of how it is:

I still, never hear back. It’s like they realize they don’t have a leg to stand on with this so they are just going to ignore me and hope it goes away. So I wait, and then I find out that this same compliance department told another Crown Princess and her girls that they CAN use the new modified Shopify sites, my version that everyone is now copying even though we took ours down to show good faith, and they are STILL not writing me back. So then I do the only thing left I can think of, and email the head of the company herself, Joni.

Well she is busy you say. She can’t respond to everyone you say. Oh but she does. Here is what she wrote to the other Crown Princess when she wrote her with the same concerns:

SO! I don’t know what to do at this point. You might ask yourself why this matters so much and why I was trying to hard to get these sites going. I will tell you. These distributors are women trying to work from home. To contribute financially, spend more time with their families, and have the freedom this company dangles in their face. That’s NOT what they get when they sign up and have to become a production factory in their home. They have to figure out to take orders, track them, manage them, figure out payment systems, expenses, and its rough. It’s rough trying to take orders on Messenger, texts, Instagram, Facebook, phone calls, and to try to get them all into the same place so you aren’t losing track of everything. It was taking so much time that it was defeating the purpose of doing this. They lure you with the “50% commissions” but even that is a lie when you realize YOU have to fund the process of a sale:

Never mind the fact that in order to get 50% off you have to order over $750 in product. If you are just ordering 1 color for 1 person, know what your “commission” is? 20%. That means you would actually be LOSING 5%!

It was a huge deal to me to help my team achieve what they were shown, more time doing the things they loved and earning an income. It started to break my heart to see women I had grown to love and are about, go into debt to “front load” like they were being encouraged to, being told to buy inventory they didn’t need because “if you have it you will sell it!” It got SO MUCH WORSE in December 2016 when the company began to spiral downhill and couldn’t keep ANYTHING in stock, they were growing too fast to keep up.

You might say that’s a good thing! That’s what I kept saying and telling myself! People are buying this stuff and loving it! Well, not exactly. See below:

That’s a loooooot of inventory. This is inventory posted on instagram of a Senegence distributor ranked to Queen. Making almost 50k a month OFF HER TEAM. Not her sales, her team. See, when Senegence began to lose control of their inventory, distributors started hoarding their inventory, and each time a color came back in stock, they’d buy 20 just in case they ever needed it. The problem is, these distributors who have a huge team, who are pushing them to “front load” are making tens of thousands of dollars a month, THEY can afford to spend ridiculous amounts of money when these colors come back. You know who can’t buy 10 colors each time? The new girl. You know, maybe you. The girl who just signed up a week ago seeing all this crazy success these other distributors are having. It is because she isn’t serious enough or invested enough? no!  Absolutely not. It’s because she is a normal person with a normal or lower than normal household income and can’t be irresponsible. Go figure.

So REALLY, tons and tons of people aren’t actually buying LipSense. Tons and tons of DISTRIBUTORS are. ESPECIALLY the ranked girls making $30-$100k a month, because you HAVE to order $400 to $900 a month just to get your check and other incentives. Who knows how many customers are actually still buying it. It’s a dog eat dog world with them and its sad.

The WORST part about this whole debacle is the ugly side to this “Senesisterhood”. It’s HORRIBLE. Once you rank to a Senegence Crown Princess, you get added to this Facebook group only for Senegence Crown Princess and above. When I got in there were only 150 in the group. I thought “Yes! finally a place I can get legit answers on random things and not have to rely on word of mouth!” BAHAHAHA!!!! I COULD NOT HAVE BEEN MORE WRONG. This is a group of the “leaders” where they mainly take screenshots of “naughty” distributors, post the screenshot and say “whose girl is this” and then guilt you into making her change something.

For instance. Lots of girls are using an incentive to get people to sign up, paying their $55 sign up fee. It’s a good idea, and if you can afford the risk of them signing up and not being profitable, that’s your call. I personally have done it and had great success. In fact, the head of the company HERSELF! Offered everyone a free sign up offer back in September 2015. Remember 2015? When the company inexplicably boomed?

 

Yeah. Her. Free sign-ups. Company immediately boomed and took off. It must work. Right? Well, Right!!! It does! So why is this a problem? Welp. Joni in 2016 said she wanted us to STOP offering to pay for sign up fees. What? Why?! It worked for you! It’s not against the rules! Isn’t it our choice?!! Technically, yes. It is. BUT. Here is another huge problem, people take  what Joni says as a legal rule, when in fact its not. Nothing is legal unless its in the P+P agreement we all signed in the beginning, remember that thing? Yeah. I told my team, do what you feel is best for you, your family, and you business. The “mean girls” (i.e. Senegence Crown Princess and above group) DID NOT LIKE THAT. I got harassing comment after harassing comment from the mean girls saying I wasn’t being a “team player” because I wasn’t telling my team to stop doing things that are perfectly within their right.

IN FAAAAACT. My second sponsor, my sponsors sponsor, sent me a horrible slew of messages after I politely but firmly refused to tell one of my girls to stop doing her giveaway because it was making other customers go with her instead. Uhhhhh. Wait, what? Her giveaway is helping her gain customers and you want me to tell her to stop?! What is wrong with these people!?

Senegence Crown Princess

Not sure what that first part says, its ok. I gotchyoo.

Proper protocol for what?!?!? Thinking outside the box? Taking a risk with her own inventory and hoping it pays off? Doing an idea to build her own clientele? NONE OF THIS IS AGAINST THE RULES AND IN FACT, IT’S BUSINESS. You don’t see Target complaining every time they lose a customer to Wal-Mart do you?

Anyway. Back to the main story: the sites. So after no one responded back to me, this Jalynn chick saying that her girls were told they can use the sites, I did a live video in a group and told some of my team,” Launch your sites. Do what YOU feel is within the rules until you get a letter from compliance telling you not to.” What in the hell is so wrong with that?

Welp. It’s not becoming of a Crown Princess to not agree with every single damn thing Senegence says. That’s what. Need proof that’s their thoughts? Here it is:

I would like to note, I NEVER said that compliance actually HAD changed the policy, I merely stated what others were saying and that compliance hadn’t told me anything. Let’s just make that part perfectly clear.

With that, I sent in a 3 page appeal to not be terminated. Groveled. Begged. All of it. Said I would be good. Had 5 of my distributors send in personal recommendations on how beneficial I am to their teams. To no avail. 30 days later I was terminated. It was crushing. I worked harder than most of the mean girls in the Crown Princess group would ever do in their lives. My team was devastated. Lots of tears. I am sure a small few applauded, can’t please everyone after all. But, I was fine in the end. It wasn’t the end of the earth.  At least I no longer had to be bullied online everyday by the mean girls of Senegence.

NOW. The good part. I was done with direct sales, I never saw myself doing another one UNLESS I knew it had the same potential to make the same kind of income I was making with Senegence. You guys. I found one. Well, it found me really. To see what I got myself into next, read this post! 

43 thoughts on “The Fall of a Senegence Crown Princess

  1. What a well written post! I also wrote a blog post on why I regret joining SeneGence, but it’s so interesting seeing your perspective since you were so far up in ranks! I included a link back to your blog post in mine, everyone needs to hear your experience!

  2. Maybe a lawsuit would be in order..Im not real happy either but I have invested too much time also. I had no idea the company was in the shape it is and I still believe I am not being told everything..they dont answer my emails either and Joni doesnt read her PM’s on FB so I dont know why she has it available. Right now all I need is my FirenIce lipstick i already sold and cant get. I sold it because thats what I do and I want some Terra Cotta Blush and they havent offered it in six months. So I believe every word you are saying. They should have let you stop and go on if it wasnt in the rules. I havent checked that part out for sure. All I know I have been dragged around for 6 months.

  3. Thank you for your unique perspective. You have confirmed what a lot of us have long suspected about SeneGence.
    Some of us have started a secret facebook group “Verbal Release Therapy”. We needed a safe place to discuss our legitimate SeneGence concerns, since sene-sisterhood is anything but a sisterhood, and more a demonic koolaid drinking Stepford Wives Association.
    If you would like to join us please let me know. If not I want to thank you for this wonderful blog that Diana has shared with our group.
    I am sorry for what you have been through, but I applaud your integrity.

      1. I actually am an IC for a 30+ Year old company called Arbonne and I am stunned at all this. I have never experienced this kind of issues with my company. There are definitely better Direct Selling companies out there. Such a shame.

    1. Robyn, will u add me to that group please? Facebook profile: Carlie Penrose Soffe

    2. I would love to be to join! My distriborship will lapse soon and I’ve been so frustrated with this company. A safe place would be great. If I have to hear more about “growing pains, and those who stick it out will be at the top!” I’ll puke.

    3. Anyone wanting to join Verbal Release Therapy, message me on my facebook; Robyn Elizabeth Berry (I’m the one from Canada).

    4. Hi Robyn, can you please add me as well? You can find me on Facebook – Sarina Jo or email me at sarina_brown at hotmail . Com

      Thanks 😊

  4. I wanted to making a Senegence Complaints Group…I guess you had to think a while to not come up with a name to the group that didnt sound threatening. They are like the police monitoring all we say and do in Senesisters. And I called Leanne Avant in Florida reaching out for help since I virtually have no upline since mine is across the country. She didnt speak first but a video popped up that she says she shared with all her girls. She looked kind of irritated in it that she even had to do it and she is telling us to PUT OUR BIG GIRL PANTS ON .. I mean I invested a lot of money in a stupid website for absolutely nothing. I feel like if I knew a lawyer, I would love to sue for pain and suffering. So Senegence wants us to grow up.. Maybe the company should have paid attention to their growth earlier and not waited til after the fact. Seems to me she trains her people to grow, grow , grow and maybe she forgot to or wasn’t minding the store. She cant expect to benefit with her success while she is letting a good bit of her Recruiters down. Yeah, just recruiters..We dont have anything to sell. Just throw money..to the company for nothing. And you were right. We have hideous webpages and I commented on it before to my family and wondered why. That can be fixed fairly quick. I take it as she doesnt care,,,Too old to do the job I guess.

  5. Thank you for this. I am one of the “naughty girls” who was brought to the attention of the Crown Princesses. I also had emails from compliance saying I wasn’t doing anything wrong. That meant nothing to them. They never even asked me. I again am out of compliance as I was told tonight. Apparently I do too much thinking outside the box. I appreciate your fresh perspective.

  6. I enjoyed reading your perspective on the sitch, Kati P. I’ve been a distributor since 2/2/17 and I’m happy as a clam because I am getting a product, LipSense color, for myself, that I use and love. You gave me insight on the company and I appreciate that. I’ve been approached over the years for many direct sales lines — skin care, health & vitamins, weight loss, etc. But I never loved any of those products and I had no interest. But I do love this product, for myself. And I think it’s a good item to have if you are in my field of work (like, my actual college major, my actual skill set and experience) so I created a FB page where I added my co-workers, and I’m doing a little bit of selling to them. But Senegence and LipSense aren’t a magic bean! And that’s where people go wrong: don’t sign on to a direct-sales company thinking it will change your life. Direct sales will never change your life, don’t fall for that. But, a tube of lip color can make your day happy, and I’m pleased to sell you that. Don’t ask about joining my team, however. That’s things I ain’t got time for. Keep writing, Kati P!

  7. Thank you for sharing. Have you contacted and/or sought legal counsel? You built a business that you own and they basically stole your business and your income by falsely accusing of things you said and did that you didn’t. This is so very sad!

  8. I joined and instantly regretted it. Wish I knew how much shipping and handling was, and that buying a few items would negate any discount…basically that not having the $800 to throw down for a 300PRV order makes my membership worthless. Could have used my $55 (plus tax and shipping and forced donation…) to buy more product at full price at least and skipped the headache

  9. Just to add to the confusion of not even understanding their own rules… every purchase a distributor makes they are required to click a button that says they have sold 70% of the items being purchased….. and are told they have to lie by everyone to even place an order. Yet everyCP and above including Joni on her video says to front load. Front loading is purchasing product you haven’t sold but as required to say That you did so the company will not be on the hook to buy back the product hey told you to buy if you wanted to be successful.

    I am greatly disturbed that someone was terminated so easily. Provided mis information. Tried to change and willing to change more yet no warning or official statement as to what not to do is provided. How are the other teams still using the same system you were terminated for?

  10. Wow, thank you. You have outlined everything I have been saying and thinking since my upline told us to get a credit card just for SeneGence, she told me she was 10k in debt and had borrowed money to keep buying but it would be ok as she was building a team. She started desperately wanting to move up the ranks so she would buy product under girls in her team who weren’t meeting the 300pv & give them a free lippy if they let her, some said no so she had them kicked out of all the support groups & called them scammers. She told everyone she was debt free but was so desperate to sell she would try and steal people Markets and would even call the market organiser & say that the distributor was no longer one & try & take there spot, she put her son in day care 5 days a week without telling her hubby (he thought he was there twice a week) she suffers from a few mental disorders and had to keep upping her dose & changing it as she was not keeping track etc. she became obsessed with the cp and turned from being a nice person into a snake, she back stabbed and lied about people & pushed people who had no money to buy. If you didn’t buy your 300pv you were shunned. Meanwhile her hubby & her have separate rooms now, her son misses his teacher whom he calls mummy, she has only made royal in waiting, I left because of these crazy women who seem to bleed SeneGence but it’s all lies, most MLM you buy a kit then everything else is online, some you don’t buy anything but SeneGence are making money from distributors not customers, because most people are good with a few lipsticks, they don’t want to buy 100 a month lol to get your 50% off its $1200 you need to spend upfront. They claim if you do 750 a month you’ll get a car – no because your group has to buy x amount so if you don’t have enough recruits no car, also they claim you will get all this free stuff sent to you. No you don’t after a year of reaching 750 each month I was sent nothing as if they mark it Limited Edition which they do for everything it doesn’t count. If we all stopped buying it for a few months the company would be ruined.

  11. So that email is to me… I was terminated for the fact they think I Manufacturered the email when I didn’t………

    1. Omg, that makes me sick! This is a super dark underbelly that I never thought existed and it scares me bad.

  12. I’m amy I had some really bad issues.

    I posted this link to many pages. Women need to know what’s going on! Thank you for your honesty!

    1. Hi Amy! Thanks for sharing our page! I emailed you some more info on Maskcara and doing both Senegence and Maskcara, if it’s something you’d be interested in. 🙂

  13. Completely Eye Opening. I have said the this is most likely going to be the fall of the company…the OOS issue that is. People buy lip colors they notice lip colors, they want lip colors…you cannot push something boring to the masses like eye cream and foundation. Well sure some people want those things but most want the lip colors. I hope you seek legal counsel.

  14. They have had zero colors to order but uplines have TONS of stock and mine is always getting boxes of lipsense. Do higher ups have dibs inn ordering product thks is shown to be out of stock? Because she magically gets stuff she didn’t have and it had been pour of stick for months?

  15. While paying for your downline’s sign up may not be against policy it does pose a few problems including the fact that it’s expensive and not everyone can do it. That was what your issue was with only some people being able to stock up. They are both cost prohibitive and shouldn’t be allowed.
    (I’m not a senegence distributor btw)
    Also – I didn’t know they were called “crown princesses” – that name is terrible!

  16. Thanks for this! I’ve also had problems with senegence. I signed up March 2016- for the record, I am just a “distributor.” I have a total of 16 people “under” me… and I was the very first in my area to sign up. I posted this on facebook last night:
    “I’ve gotten a lot of messages in the past two days about my videos being used to falsely promote another brand of lipstick…. Let me just say this:
    It’s upsetting that no one (except a special few) in the Senegence community cared (and corporate did nothing) about the fact that my face and my intellectual property was stolen from me a year ago by other “Independent Distributors.” I was even called “Un-Senesisterly” for being upset… (which isn’t even a thing).
    I joined Senegence with the understanding that I was basically buying a small franchise. I understood that I was the owner of my own personal lipstick business. I would get out of it what I put into it. It never once crossed my mind to use another “business’” advertisement. So I made my own. I bought my distributorship, my lipsense, gloss, remover, a camera, a light, a backdrop/stand and a little courage in the shape of wine to get started. A few days after I posted my first videos (with zero expectation of anyone not on my friend list seeing it), I started seeing my face/video all over social media with no credit given to ME: The Executive Producer, The Director, The Editor, The Actor, The Casting Agent, The Buyer, The Stylist, The Makeup Artist (I hope you see where I’m going with this)…
    We are all separately in business for ourselves as independent distributors. I don’t see a difference between another distributor using my face without my permission and this other makeup company using my face without my permission. Either way, I don’t profit. Does that make sense or am I crazy? I get that its false advertising for another lipstick (annoying). More importantly, why is it okay for other Senegence Distributors to steal my videos to sell their own product OR to use my face as their profile picture OR troll my video comments for customers? But it’s suddenly not okay when someone outside of Senegence is profiting from my stolen video??? I’m very confused. Shout out to the lipsense ladies who are using that company’s platform, commenting on that post with links to buy from you instead of the ladies in the video… lol.
    …..
    This has been going on for a year. I’d LOVE to see the crown princess’ talk about me! Hahaha every one of them is making money off of my face!

    1. Wow, wait, you NEVER gave ladies your permission to repost that video? You’re the really pretty blonde girl that does blackberry and then rubs it to show it doesn’t budge, right? I’ve seen that video EVERYWHERE, and it’s actually the video that really made me buy into it. That’s unacceptable, WOW! You should sue quite frankly. That’s unacceptable and not ok whatsover. So much for a “sensesister community.” That really doesn’t sit well with me wow. I’m sorry.

    2. Hi Barbie,

      I am so sorry. I was one of the Distributors that used your video on my lipsense facebook group. I was told that we were allowed to and unfortunately I didn’t question
      it further. I have to tell you it is a gorgeous video, and you are very talented.
      I will remove the video from my group.

      Best Regards.

  17. Thank you for sharing this, I started in January and was able to get some stock before everything went out. I absolutely love the product, but just the Lipsense, I have no interest in the rest of the line. I too jumped in with a huge order, took my American Express card, that had no balance, and ordered up! My balance is a little over $3000 now….I am selling it bit by bit, but I can pretty much say I’m not making any money in the end becoz of the interest I’m paying on my card balance, lesson learned….I also find that not 1 person I have sold to is interested in becoming a distributor, that’s fine, I’m pretty low key, don’t push people, but as I sell off my stock, I’m undecided if I’ll continue….

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